Zosoforum

To what extent do you believe the following:
- There is a difference in the innate potential for intelligence amongst various branches/groupings/races/ethnic groups of human beings

Given that:
- Human ethnic groups differ very largely in other observable metrics: height, pigmentation, cranial structure etc.
- There are branches of the human phylogenetic tree that have split off 200k years ago (the San for instance)
- IQ scores ('g') are excellent proxies for overall intellectual achievement
- However, The Flynn Effect (recently reversed) indicates a sustained meaningful (>1std) gain to IQ scores within groups from 1920-2000
- GWAS association and twin studies have a 'missing heritability' problem
- Historical achievement is by no means geographically evenly distributed; and exceptional groups such as Ashkenazi Jews have remarkably over-achieved in the hard sciences despite "discrimination" (pre 1950). However, Ashkenazim in Israel underperform greatly and relatively speaking, there have been very few Israeli scientists of note.
- However, the overall history of human achievement has not been a clear-cut case of outright intellectual domination (which is what you'd expect over the long run) but one of cyclical rise-and-fall with a moving locus of overperformance from group to group (Mesopotamia and Egypt laid down a lot of the foundations of post-Neolithic civ).

>However, the overall history of human achievement has not been a clear-cut case of outright intellectual domination (which is what you'd expect over the long run) but one of cyclical rise-and-fall with a moving locus of overperformance from group to group (Mesopotamia and Egypt laid down a lot of the foundations of post-Neolithic civ).


Not every ethnic group goes around the world killing people and most of them have barely any internal cohesion.

"To what extent do you believe the following:
- There is a difference in the innate potential for intelligence amongst various branches/groupings/races/ethnic groups of human beings"

I practically do not believe it at all because the differences usually cited score much more strongly with differences in historical trajectories over anything else. Indeed trying to do vulgar cause and effect on these topics are, in my opinion, so futile that I would even agree with the hypothesis that Chomsky's 'merge' hypothesis for the cognitive development of homo sapiens shows his core weaknesses and that the potential for advanced human cognition must have emerged over all branches of the human species, including the 'extinct' subspecies of hominids Chomsky writes off, over the last ~1 million years, rather than being ultimately attributable to a series of relatively recent events in the past ~200,000 years.

>>2
You should probably clarify this.

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>>1
I personally think that hereditarianism is obviously paramount in stature when it comes to man, and yes, he can be sorted by things called "race" and "ethnicity" into discrete categories with manifold dispositions and capacities.

In fact, there is almost nothing which matters more than a man's ancestry and breeding when it comes to defining him. It is what determines his endowment physically, mentally, and spiritually. Environmentalist influences only matter in the sense of allowing his genetics to fully express themselves. Analogy makes sense of this. You may bend an apple tree as it grows or deprive it of nutrients, but an apple tree is an apple tree, and you can never change that. Moreover, there are many kinds of apple which produce an incredible variety of fruits, all of which were produced through careful selective breeding imposed by either Nature or Man.

I do not think the supposed flaws in hereditarianism are anything more than our lacking of ability to properly measure it, and Judeo-Christian neuroses on the issue. I am of the opinion that third world influence is increasingly responsible for its denial, though, as hereditarianism is not even kind or comforting to supposedly "superior" peoples, let alone those besides. The growing upper classes of the orient, yuxi circle, or latin america are insecure in all respects and will claw tooth and nail for ideologies which justify themselves - not the truth.

However, the world makes no sense at all if you believe in primarily environmentalist causes, which is why magical systems such as "systemic racism" or "class-based oppression" were invented/exaggerated/repurposed to cover the gaps which could never be explained. I really dislike how uncomfortable hereditarianism is for many people, but I believe it to be the unvarnished truth.

>>1
> To what extent do you believe the following:

> - There is a difference in [...]

I don't.

> - Human ethnic groups differ [...]

Biologic variation is drowned out by how the higher level thought responsible for our current physical and social infrastructure is delivered, if it is successfully delivered at all.

> - There are branches of the human phylogenetic tree that have split off 200k years ago (the San for instance)

The age of sail alone represented reintegrations between 10 to 100 millennia in the making without sympatry.

>>4
>Analogy makes sense of this. You may bend an apple tree as it[...]

Lichen.

>[...] Judeo-Christian neuroses on the issue [...]

Its a given US legislators and the knesset both chomp at the bit to level khuzestan lest nasoraean epistatic gnosis displaces the evangeli-wokeradati'im to produce abraham's ascended phenotype.

>It is what determines his endowment physically, mentally, and spiritually

Neither the discrete determinations of our magnetic tape nor their epistatic interplay is factored into the base assumption that form follows dictation. Certain behaviors were selected for in the era of our speciation, the present disciplines our intelligence is legible through were not.

>>5
>Biologic variation is drowned out by how the higher level thought responsible for our current physical and social infrastructure is delivered, if it is successfully delivered at all.

No, that's too extreme. Sociotechnical structures mold biology, but biology molds it in turn. Human differences are obviously real, even a child sitting in a classroom can see these discrepancies of nature.
>Lichen.

not an argument
>Its a given US legislators and the knesset both chomp at the bit to level khuzestan lest nasoraean epistatic gnosis displaces the evangeli-wokeradati'im to produce abraham's ascended phenotype.

sophistry disguising a lack of argument
>Neither the discrete determinations of our magnetic tape nor their epistatic interplay is factored into the base assumption that form follows dictation. Certain behaviors were selected for in the era of our speciation, the present disciplines our intelligence is legible through were not.

you're trying so hard with this that it's no longer even grammatically correct